syncing issues

gaikokujinkyofusho · Post by **gaikokujinkyofusho** » 07 Dec 14 14:58

Hi, I am trying to sync my collection but am having various issues.
For starters I have PSU telling me some of the files that aren't synced (ie with orange dot) that I need to map to the correct file, problems are in all cases I can click on them and the full photo shows up even if the photo no longer exists on the drive (maybe that is by design? full photo stored in the database?), there are some other instances where the photos do exist and i select them but PSU is still not letting me sync them and is still giving me the option to map to the correct file (which I have tried to do multiple times).

Also, PSU does not seem to be writing changes to the files, or I am doing something wrong (Ctrl+S or right click -> metadata -> save metada to file?) a file has the keywords Bob, Anne, New, I erase New and then save but then check (say using XnView) and New is still there?! I use the Read Metadata option (Ctrl+Alt+S) and New comes right back even thought I thought I had revoked/erased it then saved my changes. If I am doing something wrong please tell me.

Finally, for now at least, my photos are being tagged multiple times with the same keyword which is really annoying. I don't know if this is a stupid user thing (ie me) or what but as I can't think of a reason to have a keyword listed twice in the same photo I would suggest that PSU automatically resolve this, that is, if the keyword "Europe" is already in there that it not add it again (and if this is not a case of stupid users then perhaps a bug?)

Suggestions would be appreciated.

Thnx

tstoddard · Post by **tstoddard** » 07 Dec 14 15:55

I would start by trying to figure out if Photo Supreme has your files mapped to the correct folders. Are you viewing your catalog using the "By Folder" view? If so, do the folders indicate that they are not found? I think they will show up with red icons but I'm not sure about that. There should be some sort of visible indication.

Another thing to do is just to right click on one thumbnail and select "Locate in Windows Explorer" from the bottom of the context menu (or use the keyboard shortcut Shift + F). I'm not sure what happens if the file you are viewing isn't mapped correctly but it should at least let you know if Photo Supreme is finding those files or not.

Hope this helps!

gaikokujinkyofusho · Post by **gaikokujinkyofusho** » 07 Dec 14 16:14

tstoddard wrote:I would start by trying to figure out if Photo Supreme has your files mapped to the correct folders. Are you viewing your catalog using the "By Folder" view? If so, do the folders indicate that they are not found? I think they will show up with red icons but I'm not sure about that. There should be some sort of visible indication.

Another thing to do is just to right click on one thumbnail and select "Locate in Windows Explorer" from the bottom of the context menu (or use the keyboard shortcut Shift + F). I'm not sure what happens if the file you are viewing isn't mapped correctly but it should at least let you know if Photo Supreme is finding those files or not.

Hope this helps!

Hi tom, actually I am using catalog view but i did check folder view, no issues with folders not being found in this instance (I have experienced that once or twice when i moved some stuff around with another program and it does indeed give you a red icon).

About locate in explorer, it was not giving me that option, only map to correct files, frustrating especially as i was actually bothering to find the right files, would show PSU the right file then it would still continue to give me the same error and not sync. I ended up manually removing the files, compacting the database turning PSU off/on, puting them back, then reimporting... a real uneeded pain but that seemed to work for the mapping part of my issue.

Mike Buckley · Post by **Mike Buckley** » 07 Dec 14 22:13

gaikokujinkyofusho wrote:I have PSU telling me some of the files that aren't synced (ie with orange dot) that I need to map to the correct file, problems are in all cases I can click on them and the full photo shows up even if the photo no longer exists on the drive (maybe that is by design? full photo stored in the database?)

If I understand you correctly, all of that is happening as it should be. If you press the Delete key, you will be given the option only to delete the file from the database, not the disk.

there are some other instances where the photos do exist and i select them but PSU is still not letting me sync them and is still giving me the option to map to the correct file (which I have tried to do multiple times).

The information that is synched includes the file path. So, when the file has to be mapped to the correct location, you won't be able to synch it until you have first mapped it.

Also, PSU does not seem to be writing changes to the files, or I am doing something wrong (Ctrl+S or right click -> metadata -> save metada to file?) a file has the keywords Bob, Anne, New, I erase New and then save but then check (say using XnView) and New is still there?! I use the Read Metadata option (Ctrl+Alt+S) and New comes right back even thought I thought I had revoked/erased it then saved my changes. If I am doing something wrong please tell me.

You're not doing anything wrong. However, if the file in question needed to be mapped, I think that would have created the situation you describe; you would need to map before changing the metadata.

Finally, for now at least, my photos are being tagged multiple times with the same keyword which is really annoying. I don't know if this is a stupid user thing (ie me) or what but as I can't think of a reason to have a keyword listed twice in the same photo I would suggest that PSU automatically resolve this, that is, if the keyword "Europe" is already in there that it not add it again (and if this is not a case of stupid users then perhaps a bug?)

Double check your hierarchy to make sure you don't have Europe included in multiple hierarchies and that the multiple entries of Europe aren't those multiple hierarchies. A particular hierarchy should never be assigned more than once to a file. Indeed, I can't get Supreme to assign it more than once on my system no matter how hard I try.

Mike Buckley · Post by **Mike Buckley** » 07 Dec 14 22:51

gaikokujinkyofusho wrote:About locate in explorer, it was not giving me that option, only map to correct files, frustrating especially as i was actually bothering to find the right files, would show PSU the right file then it would still continue to give me the same error and not sync.

As a relatively new user of Supreme, I've never experienced a file that had to be mapped. Even so, I had it happen when using IDimager and never had any problems with the mapping process. I can't imagine what is going wrong on your system. As I mentioned in my previous post, I don't think you'll be able to synch any files that need to be mapped to the correct location.

vlad · Post by **vlad** » 07 Dec 14 22:52

Mike Buckley wrote:Double check your hierarchy to make sure you don't have Europe included in multiple hierarchies and that the multiple entries of Europe aren't those multiple hierarchies. A particular hierarchy should never be assigned more than once to a file. Indeed, I can't get Supreme to assign it more than once on my system no matter how hard I try.

That's certainly a valuable suggestion. But, even if Europe is indeed included in multiple hierarchies, I'm not sure it's of any value to write it multiple times to the standard keyword field (xmp:dc:subject), although it does make sense to appear multiple times in the full hierarchical info (lr:hierarchicalSubject). I could support a feature request to check and avoid duplicated keyworks upon metadata writing (again, I'm talking only about xmp:dc:subject), but only as a user-settable option (since it could have a bit of performance impact, I guess).

gaikokujinkyofusho · Post by **gaikokujinkyofusho** » 08 Dec 14 13:48

Mike Buckley wrote:
gaikokujinkyofusho wrote:About locate in explorer, it was not giving me that option, only map to correct files, frustrating especially as i was actually bothering to find the right files, would show PSU the right file then it would still continue to give me the same error and not sync.
As a relatively new user of Supreme, I've never experienced a file that had to be mapped. Even so, I had it happen when using IDimager and never had any problems with the mapping process. I can't imagine what is going wrong on your system. As I mentioned in my previous post, I don't think you'll be able to synch any files that need to be mapped to the correct location.

Sorry, my point for mentioning the part about syning files that aren't there was more that I could view the full file (when i double click on it), i wasn't sure if that was because it was also stored in the catalog or if because it was some glitch and there wasn't actually a mapped file problem... I thought it odd that i could view what seemed to be the full file but not sync it. Guess i wasn't clear, apologies.

gaikokujinkyofusho · Post by **gaikokujinkyofusho** » 08 Dec 14 14:26

Mike Buckley wrote:
gaikokujinkyofusho wrote:I have PSU telling me some of the files that aren't synced (ie with orange dot) that I need to map to the correct file, problems are in all cases I can click on them and the full photo shows up even if the photo no longer exists on the drive (maybe that is by design? full photo stored in the database?)
If I understand you correctly, all of that is happening as it should be. If you press the Delete key, you will be given the option only to delete the file from the database, not the disk.

there are some other instances where the photos do exist and i select them but PSU is still not letting me sync them and is still giving me the option to map to the correct file (which I have tried to do multiple times).
The information that is synched includes the file path. So, when the file has to be mapped to the correct location, you won't be able to synch it until you have first mapped it.

Also, PSU does not seem to be writing changes to the files, or I am doing something wrong (Ctrl+S or right click -> metadata -> save metada to file?) a file has the keywords Bob, Anne, New, I erase New and then save but then check (say using XnView) and New is still there?! I use the Read Metadata option (Ctrl+Alt+S) and New comes right back even thought I thought I had revoked/erased it then saved my changes. If I am doing something wrong please tell me.
You're not doing anything wrong. However, if the file in question needed to be mapped, I think that would have created the situation you describe; you would need to map before changing the metadata.

Finally, for now at least, my photos are being tagged multiple times with the same keyword which is really annoying. I don't know if this is a stupid user thing (ie me) or what but as I can't think of a reason to have a keyword listed twice in the same photo I would suggest that PSU automatically resolve this, that is, if the keyword "Europe" is already in there that it not add it again (and if this is not a case of stupid users then perhaps a bug?)
Double check your hierarchy to make sure you don't have Europe included in multiple hierarchies and that the multiple entries of Europe aren't those multiple hierarchies. A particular hierarchy should never be assigned more than once to a file. Indeed, I can't get Supreme to assign it more than once on my system no matter how hard I try.

1) Not sure I follow about your delete comment

2) Sorry, when i said "which I have tried to do multiple times" i was referring to having mapped, ie found, selected, the right file multiple times. And still it acts like I haven't done it at all.

3) Actually here I am talking after I have mapped the file... or after I think I have mapped the file (and PSU thinks I haven't).

4) Ok, here I am confused. At first I do *not* have Europe (I actually do have a Europe keyword so we will go with that) keyword (label?) twice but then I set PSU to read metadata from my files and viola! i have 2-3 labels with Europe, so I run around and merge them (hope that is what I am supposed to be doing), then save, then later (I think after reading meatadata again) find multiple Europes again. Vlad, I would def vote for having PSU check for this as an option, as I apparently need it and would be willing to sacrifice the CPU for some peace of mind. I can't figure out though why this wasn't an issue with IDI, what is different between IDI and PSU that this would be an issue?

Mike Buckley · Post by **Mike Buckley** » 08 Dec 14 15:02

gaikokujinkyofusho wrote:I could view the full file (when i double click on it), i wasn't sure if that was because it was also stored in the catalog or if because it was some glitch and there wasn't actually a mapped file problem... I thought it odd that i could view what seemed to be the full file but not sync it.

I would expect to be able to view the full-size image in this situation because it is stored in the catalog database.

Mike Buckley · Post by **Mike Buckley** » 08 Dec 14 15:20

gaikokujinkyofusho wrote: 1) Not sure I follow about your delete comment

I was only making the point that when the image file needs to be mapped because PhotoSupreme doesn't know where it is on the disk, when you try to delete the file you won't be given the option to delete it from the disk.

2) Sorry, when i said "which I have tried to do multiple times" i was referring to having mapped, ie found, selected, the right file multiple times. And still it acts like I haven't done it at all.

This is the situation that isn't making any sense. The only way to get at the heart of the problem is for you to clearly explain step-by-step your mapping process including the dialog menus that are shown in each step.

3) Actually here I am talking after I have mapped the file... or after I think I have mapped the file (and PSU thinks I haven't).

My response to #2 applies here as well.

4) Ok, here I am confused. At first I do *not* have Europe (I actually do have a Europe keyword so we will go with that) keyword (label?) twice but then I set PSU to read metadata from my files and viola! i have 2-3 labels with Europe, so I run around and merge them (hope that is what I am supposed to be doing), then save, then later (I think after reading meatadata again) find multiple Europes again. Vlad, I would def vote for having PSU check for this as an option, as I apparently need it and would be willing to sacrifice the CPU for some peace of mind. I can't figure out though why this wasn't an issue with IDI, what is different between IDI and PSU that this would be an issue?

It makes sense to me that if you have several Europe keywords embedded in your image files that the corresponding catalog labels will be automatically added to your catalg once you read the metadata from your image files. IDI behaves the same as Supreme in that respect.

I think this issue probably has to do with your workflow and/or preference settings. If you're using more than one DAM to manage your metadata, trying to devise and consistently implement an error-free workflow becomes exponentially more difficult. Are you using more than one DAM? As for preference settings, please provide screen shots of your Catalog Read and Write settings.

tstoddard · Post by **tstoddard** » 08 Dec 14 15:40

Mike Buckley wrote:I would expect to be able to view the full-size image in this situation because it is stored in the catalog database.

Mike, this is a misleading if not incorrect statement. The full-size image is not stored in the catalog database. A thumbnail is stored in the thumbnail database and that thumbnail could be a large preview, in some cases it could be as large as the original but the original "full-size" image is not stored in the database. Have I misunderstood you?

Mike Buckley · Post by **Mike Buckley** » 08 Dec 14 15:48

Tom,

The clarification is that I mentioned that the full-size image is stored in the database. We know that's true in his case because the software is displaying it. I didn't mention that the original is stored there. The implication is that when a full-size preview is stored in the database, you would never know whether the software is displaying the original or the preview unless you understand how the software works.

Mike Buckley · Post by **Mike Buckley** » 08 Dec 14 16:02

Another clarification, Tom.

tstoddard wrote:A thumbnail is stored in the thumbnail database and that thumbnail could be a large preview, in some cases it could be as large as the original but the original "full-size" image is not stored in the database.

It's not just the thumbnails that are stored in the database; the previews are also stored in it. That's the advantage of using the Travel Mode. If the previews are full-size, you can add your catalog to a laptop, go on the road, and review full-size images even though the original image files are not on your laptop. Ironically, considering the largest preview size Supreme stores, the preview would rarely be the full-size. He is explaining that he's seeing the full-size of an image that needs to be mapped to the correct location so his previews are apparently full-size.

Mike Buckley · Post by **Mike Buckley** » 08 Dec 14 16:16

I just got another idea, gaikokujinkyofusho. One issue is that after going through the mapping process, the image doesn't seem to be remapped. The image file's path is displayed in the Info panel. Once you have tried to map the file to the correct location, is the correct file path displayed in the Image panel?

tstoddard · Post by **tstoddard** » 08 Dec 14 18:53

tstoddard wrote: A thumbnail is stored in the thumbnail database and that thumbnail could be a large preview, in some cases it could be as large as the original but the original "full-size" image is not stored in the database.

Sorry for any confusion I may have caused. What I should have written is that a "preview" is stored in the thumbnail database and not in the catalog database. That preview may or may not be "full-size" depending on the size of the original and the size specified in the preferences. Mike is right to say that you might not notice the difference when viewing the image even if the original file is not available. I just wanted to clarify that gaikokujinkyofusho could have been viewing a preview and not the original. "Full-size" is an ambiguous term. The preview may be full size in terms of pixels but it is probably compressed so it isn't the same as the original. I interpreted gaikokujinkyofusho's original post as questioning whether the original file is stored in the database and I just wanted to clarify that that is definitely not the case.

Also, I wanted to make a distinction between the "catalog" database and the "thumbnail" database.

In any case, it seems that gaikokujinkyofusho has already resolved his mapping issues. The metadata/label issues are different. As Mike indicated, it probably has something to do with allowing more than one program to write metadata to the same files. I think a lot of us have learned that lesson the hard way. The results can be very unpredictable when that is the case and correcting them can be very difficult.

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