Lightroom Workflow

bruhsam
Posts: 37
Joined: 19 Apr 10 23:55

Lightroom Workflow

Post by bruhsam » 16 Aug 16 20:53

Hey, all:

I've seen several mentions of a forum topic that specifically discusses the workflows involved with PSU and Lightroom together. I cannot find these topics. Anybody want to hit me with some links?

Thanks,
Bill


PhilBurton
Posts: 312
Joined: 12 Sep 10 18:47
Location: CA, USA

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by PhilBurton » 16 Aug 16 23:58

bruhsam wrote:Hey, all:

I've seen several mentions of a forum topic that specifically discusses the workflows involved with PSU and Lightroom together. I cannot find these topics. Anybody want to hit me with some links?

Thanks,
Bill
Bill,

Are you a current Lightroom user? Thinking of using Lightroom?

Phil Burton
Photo Supreme user
Home built i7 3930, 32 GB RAM, Win 10 Pro 64, latest version of Photo Supreme 3, Lightroom 6 and Photoshop CS 6 (perpetual licenses)

bruhsam
Posts: 37
Joined: 19 Apr 10 23:55

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by bruhsam » 17 Aug 16 1:48

I just installed LR and now I'm working it into my system.

bruhsam
Posts: 37
Joined: 19 Apr 10 23:55

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by bruhsam » 17 Aug 16 2:06

Thanks for the links.

Interesting stuff there. Some of it way more detailed and picky then I want. Some of you all would be dissatisfied with the dogs breakfast that I maintain of a folder organization underneath the "Pictures" folder, but it works well enough for me.

The challenge I'm trying to overcome is the new step that Lightroom adds to the process.

Previous workflow was: 1) Canon RAW -> 2) PSU -> 3) Tagging/Selecting -> 4) Basic mods within PSU -> 5) Exports for whatever
Desired workflow is: 1) Canon RAW -> 2) PSU -> 3) Tagging/Selecting -> 3a) Send Selected to LR -> 4) Mods within LR/Photoshop -> 5) Exports for Whatever -> 6) PSU of any final edited JPGs or TIFFs

I see different possible ways to do step 3a) involving either straight exports of tagged/synced RAW files to a new folder that LR can then import or [some other way as yet undefined]. Ideally, I'd tag an image in a fashion that says "Hey, LR, come import this one."

Step 6) is also kind of a doozy because I would want the final images to be associated in some fashion with their RAW counterparts (just keeping them in the same folder is acceptable as I don't rename my files after the first import) but if I'm starting from a separate folder that I'd exported RAW images from PSU for LR's use, I have no idea how'd I'd get PSU to automatically resort them correctly.

Anyway. Thinking about it.

Unlike some other people on the forum posts, I *do* plan to maintain LR's database. PSU will be the default cataloging program, but LR will be my default modification program.

PhilBurton
Posts: 312
Joined: 12 Sep 10 18:47
Location: CA, USA

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by PhilBurton » 17 Aug 16 5:38

bruhsam wrote:Thanks for the links.

Interesting stuff there. Some of it way more detailed and picky then I want. Some of you all would be dissatisfied with the dogs breakfast that I maintain of a folder organization underneath the "Pictures" folder, but it works well enough for me.

The challenge I'm trying to overcome is the new step that Lightroom adds to the process.

Previous workflow was: 1) Canon RAW -> 2) PSU -> 3) Tagging/Selecting -> 4) Basic mods within PSU -> 5) Exports for whatever
Desired workflow is: 1) Canon RAW -> 2) PSU -> 3) Tagging/Selecting -> 3a) Send Selected to LR -> 4) Mods within LR/Photoshop -> 5) Exports for Whatever -> 6) PSU of any final edited JPGs or TIFFs

I see different possible ways to do step 3a) involving either straight exports of tagged/synced RAW files to a new folder that LR can then import or [some other way as yet undefined]. Ideally, I'd tag an image in a fashion that says "Hey, LR, come import this one."

Step 6) is also kind of a doozy because I would want the final images to be associated in some fashion with their RAW counterparts (just keeping them in the same folder is acceptable as I don't rename my files after the first import) but if I'm starting from a separate folder that I'd exported RAW images from PSU for LR's use, I have no idea how'd I'd get PSU to automatically resort them correctly.

Anyway. Thinking about it.

Unlike some other people on the forum posts, I *do* plan to maintain LR's database. PSU will be the default cataloging program, but LR will be my default modification program.
Bill,

Aside from the fact that you shoot Canon and I shoot Nikon, :) we are trying to do exactly the same with our workflows. I also maintain LR's database even though PSU is my default cataloging program.

One of the reasons I chose LR is that it is a non-destructive photo editor. And that you create virtual copies of an image so that you can edit the same image with different results. As someone pointed out in one of the links above, he doesn't save a copy of all his exported image. What is saved in LR is the editing and exporting instructions.

I feel like we ought to carry on this conversation offline so as not to bore everyone else. if that interests you, I'll post my email and we can exchange messages that way.

Phil
Photo Supreme user
Home built i7 3930, 32 GB RAM, Win 10 Pro 64, latest version of Photo Supreme 3, Lightroom 6 and Photoshop CS 6 (perpetual licenses)

Stephen
Posts: 658
Joined: 01 Oct 14 10:15

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by Stephen » 17 Aug 16 10:15

With respect I feel it would be useful to read this online, as others are bound to have similar interests ;-)
I don't use Lightroom but that does not mean I never will.
Never say never change, but using Mac since 2005. Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2605. I endorse the interoperability of files between applications and systems.

bruhsam
Posts: 37
Joined: 19 Apr 10 23:55

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by bruhsam » 17 Aug 16 14:05

I'll post to this when I have a bit more detail about how I'm managing LR into the flow. Right now, on a strictly temp basis, I'm exporting to a specific folder from PSU (named "PSU Export to LR") and using that to import to LR library. The obvious flaw is that I'll have a bunch of images sitting in that folder that are more difficult to delete because I have to leave the ones that I've modified in LR in place, so I don't break the LR Library database connections.

Yes I can see ways to move them around and put them back in original folders using folder commands, but the fundamental issue is my laziness. I want this all to happen seamlessly. I *don't* move files around in PSU unless I am moving from my internal HDD to an external HDD. This happens about once a year and it's a chore and I don't like it so I avoid any other activities similar to it.

sanphotgn
Posts: 469
Joined: 26 Aug 07 18:06

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by sanphotgn » 17 Aug 16 16:50

Desired workflow is: 1) Canon RAW -> 2) PSU -> 3) Tagging/Selecting -> 3a) Send Selected to LR -> 4) Mods within LR/Photoshop -> 5) Exports for Whatever -> 6) PSU of any final edited JPGs or TIFFs
Do you want LR to only database the photos you want to modify or be a "mirror" of sorts to your PSU database, in that it contains everything? The latter is my model. Thus, the folder structure in PSU is the same folder structure in LR. The keyword structure (crucial - if you want the databases to "talk" with one another) in PSU is the same keyword structure in LR. If this is your goal, Verify in PSU and Synchronize in LR become the go-to commands.

What is really important: you start with new databases / catalogs. You set them up (settings, options, keywords, ...) before importing anything.
Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2602 (64 bits) (Windows)

bruhsam
Posts: 37
Joined: 19 Apr 10 23:55

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by bruhsam » 17 Aug 16 18:45

In direct response, I really only want my identified "to be modified" images to be in Lightroom. So a complete duplication would be overreach. Not necessarily a bad overreach, but it's beyond my ideal situation.

There's a few things you stated here that I and others might find useful for you to expand on:
The keyword structure (crucial - if you want the databases to "talk" with one another)
Crucial, but unspecified. How is it crucial and how should it be set up?
Verify in PSU and Synchronize in LR become the go-to commands.
I'm unsure what you mean by "Verify" in PSU, and "Synchronize" in LR.
What is really important: you start with new databases / catalogs. You set them up (settings, options, keywords, ...) before importing anything.
But how? For those of us who might be doing this new, this is a tantalizing bit of information that doesn't actually help.

A further note on the setting up of new databases/catalogs: if you do a search on my name and check out my user posts, you can infer that I've had a great deal of trouble with catalogs. All of the work I'm doing needs to be backward compatible to my older catalogs otherwise the benefit is reduced significantly.

This entry here might be best stripped out of the "Lightroom Workflow" and into a new subject entitled "Initial Lightroom Setup for PSU."

sanphotgn
Posts: 469
Joined: 26 Aug 07 18:06

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by sanphotgn » 18 Aug 16 1:05

In direct response, I really only want my identified "to be modified" images to be in Lightroom.
Do you want any of the metadata created by Lightroom to be in Photo Supreme? In other words, you modify the RAW file in Lightroom and then go back to Photo Supreme and use the Verify feature in Photo Supreme to add the Lightroom metadata to Photo Supreme. (Depending on how Lightroom is opened and if both applications are open at the same time, you might not have to use Verify to get the metadata into Photo Supreme, but I always use it to make sure.)

Keyword structure:

You want the parent / top level Categories / Keywords of Lightroom to also be the parent / top level Categories / Keywords in Photo Supreme.

For example, if my top level Keywords in Lightroom are:

People
Events
Animals
Projects

Before using Photo Supreme, I would add any of the above that aren't included in the default install of Photo Supreme.

Photo Supreme settings regarding Categories / Keywords are also very important. Screen prints of the settings are located here:

http://forum.idimager.com/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=24230

Verify Folder and Synchronize Folder are the features in Photo Supreme and Lightroom, respectively, one would use if one wanted a kind of "mirror" of the databases. For example, add a bunch of new labels / keywords to images in Photo Supreme, open Lightroom, in Lightroom locate the folder one has been working on, right click, choose Synchronize Folder. The reverse is basically true for Photo Supreme, except one would choose Verify Folder.

I don't have one database (catalog). I have several. Both applications make this very easy to accomplish. In Photo Supreme: Tools - Catalog - Create a new Catalog. And I take advantage of the command line startup parameters available in Photo Supreme so each catalog is independent of the others.

Command line startup parameters:

http://www.senoiaphoto.com/psu

In Lightroom, it is File - New Catalog.

Before using the new catalogs, I set up each: Categories / Keywords, settings / options, both applications are set to automatically write to XMP. I test with a few images to make sure everything is working. Then I begin importing.
Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2602 (64 bits) (Windows)

Hondor
Posts: 91
Joined: 05 Jul 14 15:52

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by Hondor » 21 Aug 16 9:40

I have Lightroom as my external editor from within PSU. I only organise in PSU, so everytime I start LR, I have to import the photo, and before exiting LR, I remove the photo again. I convert to DNG, so I have all my LR mods as a high-quality JPG embedded within my DNG. I assume, that that's the JPG that PSU exports as needed. I wouldn't trust PSU to be able to interpret my LR edits in the actual RAW.

It's a kludgy way of doing things and probably only works, because I only keep rather few photos to work with.
- no previous experience with Idimager whatsoever...

tstoddard
Posts: 584
Joined: 07 Sep 12 12:51

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by tstoddard » 05 Sep 16 14:24

Hondor wrote: I convert to DNG, so I have all my LR mods as a high-quality JPG embedded within my DNG.
Hondor,

I have just started experimenting with LIghtroom and the dng option seems to be a good one. Would you elaborate a bit for me about how and when you convert to dng and also how to get Lightroom to embed a high-quality JPG into the dng file?

I like the way that I can process my raw files in LIghtroom and not have to output them to jpg but then PSU becomes much less useful. In essence, if I don't output jpegs, then PSU becomes simply a labeling tool for me. Since I tend to take lots of pictures and only share a handful, much of my time spent using PSU is spent reviewing full size jpegs, comparing them, and then sharing them. If I'm going to process my raw files in Lightroom and not create jpegs, then I am forced to use Lightroom to do my previewing, comparing, and sharing. Actually, I find Lightroom to be very capable of doing most of what I need to do but the previewing and comparing is much faster and easier in PSU. Of course, there is nothing in Lightroom to compare to PSU's labeling functionality.

If only we could add camera raw to PSU as a plugin.
Tom Stoddard

PhilBurton
Posts: 312
Joined: 12 Sep 10 18:47
Location: CA, USA

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by PhilBurton » 05 Sep 16 19:01

tstoddard wrote:
Hondor wrote: I convert to DNG, so I have all my LR mods as a high-quality JPG embedded within my DNG.
Hondor,

I have just started experimenting with LIghtroom and the dng option seems to be a good one. Would you elaborate a bit for me about how and when you convert to dng and also how to get Lightroom to embed a high-quality JPG into the dng file?
There is a lot of controversy about whether or not to convert RAW files to DNG with good arguments pro and con. I suggest that you search the Adobe web site and also http://www.lightroomforums.net.
I like the way that I can process my raw files in LIghtroom and not have to output them to jpg but then PSU becomes much less useful. In essence, if I don't output jpegs, then PSU becomes simply a labeling tool for me.
With Lightroom, you do all your culling and editing, and those edits are saved non-destructively. You can then export images for various purposes.
Since I tend to take lots of pictures and only share a handful, much of my time spent using PSU is spent reviewing full size jpegs, comparing them, and then sharing them. If I'm going to process my raw files in Lightroom and not create jpegs, then I am forced to use Lightroom to do my previewing, comparing, and sharing.
Actually IF you shoot RAW, which is highly recommended, then you really don't need to shoot RAW+JPG, although LR is fully capable of recognizing an image that is both RAW and JPG. (By the way, apparently by design, PSu does not treat a RAW and JPG as one image, which is a beef I have with PSu.)
Actually, I find Lightroom to be very capable of doing most of what I need to do but the previewing and comparing is much faster and easier in PSU.

Of course, there is nothing in Lightroom to compare to PSU's labeling functionality.

If only we could add camera raw to PSU as a plugin.
Or PSu as a Lightroom plugin. (I know, dream on ...) :roll:
Photo Supreme user
Home built i7 3930, 32 GB RAM, Win 10 Pro 64, latest version of Photo Supreme 3, Lightroom 6 and Photoshop CS 6 (perpetual licenses)

Stephen
Posts: 658
Joined: 01 Oct 14 10:15

Re: Lightroom Workflow

Post by Stephen » 05 Sep 16 20:34

PhilBurton said:
"(By the way, apparently by design, PSu does not treat a RAW and JPG as one image, which is a beef I have with PSu.)"

I am pleased that it doesn't!
Never say never change, but using Mac since 2005. Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2605. I endorse the interoperability of files between applications and systems.

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