Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Larry56
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Larry56 » 26 Sep 16 23:17

For what it's worth, it seems my original complaints have been fixed. The latest version, v9.3, seems to not only keep color labels but also all the meta data seems to be intact. At least the camera and lens information so it seems to play nice with PSu now.

I've tested on only a few images from different camera/lens combinations but all have been successful. Hopefully I won't have to come back and make a correction.

Stephen
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Stephen » 30 Sep 16 15:51

Larry56 wrote:For what it's worth, it seems my original complaints have been fixed.
Larry, that's rather a humble comment ;-) For me it is worth a lot!!!

I hope to download and test 9.3 in the next few days. Not to appear lazy, but is your workflow mentioned in one of the previous 46 posts in this thread? Thanks
Never say never change, but using Mac since 2005. Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2605. I endorse the interoperability of files between applications and systems.

Larry56
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Larry56 » 30 Sep 16 16:55

Stephen, I don't think I've mentioned my workflow. It's rather simplistic as I don't do professional photography. I'm just a learning enthusiast. So here it is....

1. Import from card into Photo Supreme into a Pending folder. I have PSu assign a blue color label and basic creator information on import. I almost always shoot in RAW + jpg so both are imported into a single folder (Pending).
2. Cull images in PSu.
3. Assign keywords and ratings.
4. Enter Headline information and if needed Description.
5. Move images from Pending to monthly folder for those I don't want to further process.

Here's where it can get convoluted.
If I've used a Panasonic camera I will open Lightroom and write metadata to at least jpgs within Lightroom. The reason is that for some reason PSu doesn't display correct camera information such as size or camera lens. I've found that writing in LR fixes that and PSu displays all information. I assume it has something to do with the Metadata format in the jpg created by the camera.

6. I sometimes use Lightroom to process but not all the time. Kind of depends on my mood and how much time I have. I will however frequently process selected RAWs in all three - Lightroom, Dxo, and now Capture One (since v9.3). Processing is pretty much using standard adjustments although I find Lightroom easier if I want to make other adjustments.
7. Return to PSu and verify folder.
8. Compare the OOC and processed jpgs (or tiffs) and select one to keep.
9. Print, email, or upload to Smugmug those that I want to inflict on family.

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fbungarz
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by fbungarz » 30 Sep 16 16:57

Hi Stephen,
I will take a trip to Photokina to discuss this with them.
Just wondering: Did they ´finally fix this on their own or did you convince them that they treated the metadata badly...!?
Cheers,
Frank

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fbungarz
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by fbungarz » 30 Sep 16 16:59

Larry,
Here's where it can get convoluted.
If I've used a Panasonic camera I will open Lightroom and write metadata to at least jpgs within Lightroom. The reason is that for some reason PSu doesn't display correct camera information such as size or camera lens. I've found that writing in LR fixes that and PSu displays all information. I assume it has something to do with the Metadata format in the jpg created by the camera.
Did you try in PSu to use "Convert Metadata to XMP"? Perhaps that's an easier option to fix the files than having to go through Lightroom. If the Panasonic only writes Exif and not XMP, using "Convert Metadata to XMP" should fix this in PSu...

Stephen
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Stephen » 30 Sep 16 17:28

fbungarz wrote:Just wondering: Did they ´finally fix this on their own or did you convince them that they treated the metadata badly...!?
Who knows? I have yet to test and verify that it will work for me.
Never say never change, but using Mac since 2005. Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2605. I endorse the interoperability of files between applications and systems.

Stephen
Posts: 553
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Stephen » 30 Sep 16 17:31

Larry56 wrote:Stephen, I don't think I've mentioned my workflow. It's rather simplistic as I don't do professional photography. I'm just a learning enthusiast.
Oh, a simplistic approach is my goal too. It just rarely works that way ;-)

I tend to agree with Frank when he suggests to avoid the detour to Lightroom by executing "Convert Metadata to XMP" first. I hope it works.
Never say never change, but using Mac since 2005. Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2605. I endorse the interoperability of files between applications and systems.

Larry56
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Larry56 » 01 Oct 16 2:08

First, a correction. I go to Lightroom and write metadata to RAW, not jpg as I said above. I need to copy lens information to jpg metadata manually.

Thanks for the suggestion and it would be nice if "Convert Metatada to XMP" in PSu worked but it doesn't work for some reason. I assume it's a Panasonic thing considering LR writes missing RAW info but not jpg info. However both DXO and Capture One display the appropriate RAW information. Maybe because they read from different parts of the XMP or metadata in jpg than PSu?

While it's an extra step I've adapted since it's just one camera and doesn't take too much time or effort.

Stephen
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Stephen » 02 Oct 16 21:03

Larry56 wrote:First, a correction. I go to Lightroom and write metadata to RAW, not jpg as I said above.
OK, but you could probably do that in PSu with the setting shown below, if you wish.
Larry56 wrote:I need to copy lens information to jpg metadata manually.
Where do you do that, in LR or in PSu?
Larry56 wrote:Thanks for the suggestion and it would be nice if "Convert Metatada to XMP" in PSu worked but it doesn't work for some reason.
Sorry, but I don't know why not.
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Never say never change, but using Mac since 2005. Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2605. I endorse the interoperability of files between applications and systems.

Larry56
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Larry56 » 03 Oct 16 3:01

Stephen wrote:OK, but you could probably do that in PSu with the setting shown below, if you wish.
I'm not sure which settings to check. If it's just the "Write catalog data to IDimager ICS scheme" then I already had that checked. Or are you saying I should check the "Allow embedded meta writing..." which is where your mouse cursor was pointing? I didn't have it checked but checking it didn't make a difference.

Stephen wrote:Where do you do that, in LR or in PSu?
I do it in PSu

Stephen wrote:Sorry, but I don't know why not.
I don't either. If anyone has a Panasonic camera and wants to confirm I'd appreciate it. The camera is a Panasonic GX85. I did submit to Mantis but it's not high on Hert's list. We have had some conversation about it though.

jstartin
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Lens info and GX85

Post by jstartin » 03 Oct 16 12:51

Larry,
I looked at a GX85 .RW2 sample file downloaded from Imaging Resource. It may be a rather new camera, but the Exif seems to be written to the 2.2 standard and not the more recent 2.3. The older standard did not cater for writing lens information into the public, standardised metadata (I think Exif pre-dated digital interchangeable lens cameras :wink: ) and the GX85 records it in the private maker notes.

Exiftool can extract it from there, and presumably so can Capture One, but PSu does not (Hert, quite properly, sticks very carefully to what is covered by standards). A solution (workaround) that I have used for other cameras and tested on RW2 files untouched by C1, is to use Exiftool and ExiftoolGUI; the menu item Modify|Exif: LensInfo from Makernotes... copies the lens info to a PSu-friendly location. Either do this before import or use Convert metadata to XMP afterwards.

I can't test what happens when C1 "touches" the .RW2, or with jpegs written by C1, but from your description I would think that C1 is writing the lens info into incomplete or imperfect XMP which PSu will not use. Convert metadata to XMP (without the Exiftool step) will just replace this with "proper" XMP according to the standards, which leaves lens info stuck in the maker notes again.
Jim (Photo Supreme: AMD Quad-Core A8-5500 Accelerated Processor 3.2 GHz; internal AMD Radeon™ HD7560D; 4GB DDR3 SDRAM; Win7x64)

Stephen
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Stephen » 03 Oct 16 17:38

Following on from Jim's useful comments, the following... I did a test with a pair of Sony files RAW and JPG (until their latest firmware) imported and labelled in PSu. I sent the RAW to C1 version 9.3 and exported a jpg. The result is that BOTH lens information AND focal length are shown in PSu. Both fields are important if you want to know which focal length was used on a zoom lens and also which exact model of lens was used. This is good news and the first time I have seen it on files coming from C1!

Not good is that the description is missing. Also C1 is doing something wrong with the keywords. There was one label which was NOT assigned to its parents and now all parents are showing as keywords! So once more, the (or some labels) need to be deselected and re-selected. Any synonyms are similarly afflicted, as has always been, but that is another topic.

Re. exif version:
Original RAW = 0230
Original JPG = 0221
Processed JPG from C1 = 0221 and furthermore, all the maker notes continue to be deleted (as shown by exiftool), as has been the case so far with C1.

I don't know why Sony creates the JPG with version 0221. They make great cameras but have a lot to learn about software ;-)

However, why the latest version of Capture One (v.9.3) still uses 0221 is puzzling.
Never say never change, but using Mac since 2005. Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2605. I endorse the interoperability of files between applications and systems.

Larry56
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Larry56 » 04 Oct 16 1:43

Thank you Jim for your informative comment. Once more I've learned something on this forum.

Stephen, thanks for the report on C1. I too had discovered the fix of lens and camera information but hadn't checked on keywords or description. I'll have to test that or plan on fixing it after processing. I'll also contact support about it after doing some tests.

Larry56
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Larry56 » 04 Oct 16 2:15

Well, after some quick testing, I have some good news and bad news.

I tested processing in C1 to jpg RAW's from a Canon 5D Mark III and a Panasonic GX85. In PSu both had labels under parents and both showed camera model and lens information before procsssing. I processed to jpg and verified folders in PSu and both had labels correct as well as camera model and lens information. However, in PSu the date and metering mode (a field I have displayed) were missing. The good news was I could write to file in PSu and both fields were completed.

I'm glad PSu makes it easy to fix some of these issues. I'll do more testing to be sure and will report back if I find anything else.

Stephen, did you try to write to file in PSu to see if PSu fixed the C1 files?

Stephen
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Re: Capture One Pro 9 with Photo Supreme Workflow

Post by Stephen » 04 Oct 16 19:22

Larry56 wrote: I'll also contact support about it after doing some tests.
More tests are needed her too, but every feedback to C1 coming from a different user will underline that many are affected.

Another quick test proved that no pattern can be determined yet...

Missing description. In the first test, now just revised, the description (for unknown reasons) was not shown in C1, so could not be exported.
In my latest test the description was shown in C1 and also in the file arriving in PSu, however this time the copyright information was missing.

N.B. My constraints:
a. Test shots are normally used for ‘experiments’ like this in case I need to document them to 3rd parties.
b. I want to use images where the lens is recognized in the exif, although that problem might now have been solved.
Some of those images in a and b have already been opened in C1, so the results might not be virgin.
Never say never change, but using Mac since 2005. Photo Supreme 3.3.0.2605. I endorse the interoperability of files between applications and systems.

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